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Jason Warnes: In Service Of The Problem

Jason Warnes, Marketing Advisor and Investor, on why the fundamentals of great marketing haven’t moved from David Ogilvy’s kitchen discipline to AKQA’s early digital days, why marketing is a capability and not a function, and how AI’s absorption of the optimisation layer is exposing brand and creative as the real differentiator.

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 ·  The Business of Marketing  · S5 E77  · 33 min
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"Strategic capability cuts through everything. A function just mirrors the silos on the other side."

The Conversation with John Horsley

Thirty years of agency and consulting leadership, from the pioneering days at AKQA through Partner at Deloitte Digital to Global Client Lead for Shell and Volvo at WPP, and why the fundamentals haven’t moved even as the tools have.

Jason Warnes spent fifteen years at AKQA, rising from Group Account Director on BMW, Rover and Ferrari to Managing Director and Global Head of Talent. Three of those years were in Berlin (2010:2013), where he set up AKQA’s seventh office and led the work for VW and Audi, including the winning pitch for Volkswagen’s global digital business strategy and the beta launch of Audi’s on-demand mobility service in San Francisco. He was Partner at Deloitte Digital from 2015, and from 2018 spent eight years at WPP as Global Client Lead for Shell and then Volvo as Managing Partner of the AKQA Group. Since June 2025 he has worked independently.

In this conversation with host John Horsley, Warnes argues the fundamentals of great marketing haven’t shifted from David Ogilvy’s kitchen discipline to AKQA’s early days, explains why marketing is a capability rather than a function and why that distinction is where client-side transformation breaks down, sets out the three conditions real business transformation needs, and makes the case that AI’s absorption of the optimisation layer is finally exposing brand and creative as the real differentiator.

Key Takeaways

  • The fundamentals haven’t changed from Ogilvy’s kitchen discipline. Attention to detail, nothing leaves the studio unless it is perfect, still holds today.
  • Marketing is a capability, not a function. Client organisations that treat it as a function end up with experience teams talking to experience agencies, campaign teams to campaign agencies, and the thread never runs through.
  • Real transformation needs three things: CEO mandate, practical understanding of the work, and realistic time horizons. Missing one, the programme stalls.
  • As AI absorbs the optimisation and performance layers, brand and creative become the exposed surface. Smart CFOs are beginning to see AI as the case for stronger brand, not weaker.
  • The new front line for brands is how they appear in AI engines and agents, rather than how they rank in search. The brands that invest in visibility now will be the ones AI recommends later.

Topics Covered

  1. 01 Thirty years across AKQA, Deloitte Digital and WPP
  2. 02 Why the fundamentals of great marketing haven’t changed from Ogilvy to AKQA
  3. 03 Capability versus function: where client-side transformation breaks down
  4. 04 The three conditions real business transformation requires
  5. 05 Why AI makes the case for stronger brand, not weaker, and the new front line inside AI engines

Key Exchanges

05
01 Has the industry evolved since AKQA’s pioneering days, or have we just layered technology on the same fundamentals?

The principles between AKQA and Ogilvy were exactly the same. Attention to detail. Nothing leaves the studio unless it’s absolutely perfect.

Warnes argues the fundamentals of great marketing haven’t moved. David Ogilvy ran his agency like a kitchen in a restaurant. AKQA’s early digital work held to the same discipline. The tools have changed, the channels have multiplied, but the craft that earns trust and cut-through is the same one Ogilvy wrote about in Confessions of an Advertising Man.

02 Where does marketing go wrong in the client organisation?

Consultancies are capability-led. Marketing inside client organisations ends up as a function. That’s where the thread breaks.

In a consultancy, strategic consulting is a capability that cuts through delivery, technology and every other practice. In most holding companies and client organisations, marketing sits as one of many functions. The experience team talks to the experience agency, the campaign team to the campaign agency, the digital team to the digital agency. The thread never runs through. Treat marketing as a capability and it cuts across the business. Treat it as a function and you inherit whatever silos the org chart already has.

03 What does real business transformation require?

CEO buy-in and mandate. Practical understanding. Time. Three things, no substitutes.

Warnes has been on both sides: delivering transformation at Deloitte and receiving the hundred-page consulting deck at WPP. Neither works without all three conditions. A mandate without practical understanding produces shelfware. Practical understanding without CEO backing gets overruled. And anyone signing up for transformation on a one-year horizon is setting themselves up to fail. Real change takes years of committed investment.

04 What happens to brand as AI absorbs performance?

When AI takes the heavy lifting, what is exposed is brand and creative.

The fixation on optimisation has held back brand investment for a decade, Warnes argues. As AI turns optimisation into table stakes, brand distinctiveness becomes the exposed surface. The smart CFOs are beginning to see AI as the case for stronger brand investment, rather than an excuse to cut it. When everyone has the same performance tools, the only thing left to compete on is whether people want what you make.

05 Your next customer is a robot. Does that change the brand playbook?

You give the agent parameters. Only engage with brands who respond quickly. Only above a review score. Then you still decide.

Agentic commerce turns trust signals into filters. But Warnes is clear that the human doesn’t step out of the loop. The agent narrows the field; the person still makes the call. For marketers that means a new front line, one where how brands appear inside AI engines and agents matters more than how they rank in search. The brands that invest in visibility now will be the ones AI recommends later.

S5 E77Season & Episode
33 minDuration
30 Years across Agency, Consulting and Client-Side Leadership
15 Years at AKQA, Including Four Running the Berlin Office

"The new front line for brands is AI, not search."

Hear Jason on
The Business of Marketing
Season 5 Episode 77 33 min
Apple Podcasts→ Spotify→ Jason's full profile→ Jason on LinkedIn→
Read the full transcript
Lightly edited for readability.

John Horsley Let’s go back to the AKQA days. You were pioneering digital. Has the industry evolved, or have we just laid more technology on top of the same fundamentals?

Jason Warnes The fundamentals remain pretty consistent. I’m a big fan of David Ogilvy. He ran his agency like a kitchen in a restaurant. The principles between AKQA in the early days and Ogilvy were exactly the same. Attention to detail, nothing leaves the studio unless it is absolutely perfect. That was the real key to AKQA’s success. The tools change. The discipline doesn’t.

John Horsley Where do you think client organisations misunderstand marketing?

Jason Warnes There is a real contrast between consulting and agencies. In consultancies, strategic consulting is a capability that cuts through everything. In a client organisation or a holding company, marketing is treated as a function. Experience team talks to experience agency. Campaign team to campaign agency. Digital team to digital agency. You never get a consistent thread. That is where transformation breaks.

John Horsley What does real business transformation require?

Jason Warnes Three things. CEO buy-in and mandate, because nothing gets green-lit without it. Practical understanding of what the work looks like. You cannot land a hundred-page strategy deck on the table and say save thirty percent of your marketing operations. And time. A realistic horizon. Transformation does not happen in a year. You have to commit to multi-year investment.

John Horsley What happens to brand as AI absorbs performance marketing?

Jason Warnes When AI takes a lot of that groundwork and heavy lifting away, what is exposed is creative and brand. The fixation with optimisation and performance marketing has been a detraction from really investing in the brand. When optimisation becomes table stakes, there is no stand-out without the brand. AI is making the case for stronger brand, not weaker.

John Horsley Your next customer is a robot. Does that change the game?

Jason Warnes The new front line for brands is how they appear inside AI, not in search engine optimisation. The agent will narrow the field based on the parameters you give it: review scores, response times, brand preferences. Then you still make the decision. But the brands visible in that first filter, that is where you need to invest now.

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